Difference between pages "User:Augur ./Wiki Navigation Ideas" and "User talk:Augur ."

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(First attempt (22:48, 10 December 2014 (AEDT)): more discussion on this.)
 
(Explaining the lca2015 and other lca wikis: reply)
 
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= First attempt (22:48, 10 December 2014 (AEDT)) =
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= So much stuff isn't working here yet =
Here are some loose ideas I've thrown together in a brainstorming session, for how to possibly structure the navigation system for the LCA2015 wiki. I've noticed from past LCA wikis that they have become a lot flatter and less structured since the 2009 one, and they seem to be quite difficult to navigate. I'd like to look at improving this with the LCA2015 wiki. Please let me know what you think. Click the image below to see it in full size. [[User:Augur_.|<font color="#703931">'''ᏜᏠᎶᏠᏑ'''</font>]][[User_talk:Augur_.|<font size="4" color="#723a32">&#x2710;</font>]][[Special:Contributions/Augur_.|<font size="4" color="#723a32">&#x2315;</font>]] 22:48, 10 December 2014 (AEDT)
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I'm starting to think that much of the normal stuff I regularly do in other wikis is reliant on [[Special:Version|installed extensions]]. So much of what I've been trying here already, such as adding my [[User_talk:Augur_./box#Something_is_not_set_up_right_here|box template]], or altering the <nowiki>{{DISPLAYTITLE}}</nowiki> for my home page, doesn't seem to be working. I've already put in a request (via [[User:Lin Nah|Lin Nah]]) for a list of common MediaWiki extensions to be installed here, to support some of the features I use regularly. Will have to wait and see if/when some of them get installed, whether the tricks I've been trying to use will suddenly start working. [[User:Augur_.|<font color="#703931">'''ᏜᏠᎶᏠᏑ'''</font>]][[User_talk:Augur_.|<font size="4" color="#723a32">&#x2710;</font>]][[Special:Contributions/Augur_.|<font size="4" color="#723a32">&#x2315;</font>]] 18:06, 8 December 2014 (AEDT)
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:It is not just the extensions, but some of the back-end configuration is also not set up the way I'd normally expect a wiki to be set up. For instance, the [https://www.mediawiki.org/wiki/Manual:$wgNamespacesWithSubpages $wgNamespacesWithSubpages] option has not been enabled for the Template: namespace, meaning that the normal way of documenting templates using the <nowiki>{{/doc}}</nowiki> command is unavailable. [https://www.mediawiki.org/wiki/Manual:Interwiki InterWiki] doesn't seem to have been enabled either. Also, my [[Special:Preferences|Preferences]] don't seem to have saved between sessions, so I've lost my custom signature between logins, along with my regional settings, etc. I'd really appreciate having access to the back-end of the wiki, to set some of this stuff up properly, if that's okay?  [[User:Augur .|Augur .]] ([[User talk:Augur .|talk]]) 19:19, 8 December 2014 (AEDT)
  
[[File:141211-1238-proposed-wiki-nav-structure.png|800px]]
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:: just sent you an email. Suggest you check out previous LCA wikis to see how it is being used by the conference attendees. [[User:Lin Nah|Lin Nah]] ([[User talk:Lin Nah|talk]]) 19:45, 8 December 2014 (AEDT)
 +
:::Thanks Lin, got that. Looks like the file uploads are working now. I'd still like to get some of those MW extensions installed from the list I gave you earlier. [[User:Augur_.|<font color="#703931">'''ᏜᏠᎶᏠᏑ'''</font>]][[User_talk:Augur_.|<font size="4" color="#723a32">&#x2710;</font>]][[Special:Contributions/Augur_.|<font size="4" color="#723a32">&#x2315;</font>]] 13:33, 9 December 2014 (AEDT)
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::::I'm stalled again. Much of what I want to accomplish at the moment relies heavily on [https://www.mediawiki.org/wiki/Extension:ParserFunctions ParserFunctions], such as the ever-handy '''<nowiki>{{#if:}}</nowiki>''' conditional statement. Any chance that could be the first MW extension from my wishlist to be installed, please? [[User:Augur_.|<font color="#703931">'''ᏜᏠᎶᏠᏑ'''</font>]][[User_talk:Augur_.|<font size="4" color="#723a32">&#x2710;</font>]][[Special:Contributions/Augur_.|<font size="4" color="#723a32">&#x2315;</font>]] 14:43, 9 December 2014 (AEDT)
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::::: I didn't ask for the parser function to be installed because I wanted to see what else you want installed (see below) and check them out. Also didn't think my upload problem would be resolved so quickly.[[User:Lin Nah|Lin Nah]] ([[User talk:Lin Nah|talk]]) 16:32, 9 December 2014 (AEDT)
  
:We probably should have had this discussion ages ago, rather than just the mere 4 or so weeks out from LCA that it is now. I take some responsibility for that, as I did put my hand up earlier on in the year to help out with the wiki. It would have been good to talk to the Ghosts about previous wikis, or even to have seen feedback from previous LCA delegates about what they liked and didn't like about the wikis at past LCA's, from the feedback forms. As that didn't happen, I'm inviting discussion here, now.
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== Media Wiki extensions ==
 +
Can you list the extensions you want installed or is the [https://www.mediawiki.org/wiki/Extension:ParserFunctions ParserFunctions] the only extension?
 +
It just saves time if we have a list. Before they are installed, someone needs to ensure the stuff on the list will not result in unintended consequences if used is allowed. [[User:Lin Nah|Lin Nah]] ([[User talk:Lin Nah|talk]]) 16:32, 9 December 2014 (AEDT)
 +
:I thought you might ask. I've just created such a list [[User:Augur_./MW Extension Shoppinglist|here]]. [[User:Augur_.|<font color="#703931">'''ᏜᏠᎶᏠᏑ'''</font>]][[User_talk:Augur_.|<font size="4" color="#723a32">&#x2710;</font>]][[Special:Contributions/Augur_.|<font size="4" color="#723a32">&#x2315;</font>]] 16:39, 9 December 2014 (AEDT)
  
:I'm new to LCA this year, even though I've been using Linux since about 2008. Nobody likes a n00b coming in and telling everyone how to improve things. It's human nature to reject that type of imposition, whether the suggestions have any merit and value or not. I'm hoping to avoid having that happen here by opening discussion on-wiki about how to organise the wiki for LCA2015. You'll find me very open to suggestions, probably more open than some of the LCA committee would like me to be, in fact. I prefer to do this type of thing out in the open. I'm more comfortable with a wiki or Twitter than I am with email. I'm old enough now to take the flack that comes with communicating in an open environment, (but I'm not too old to learn new tricks). If you want to disagree with me publicly, go right ahead! Everyone has the right to their own opinion. I trust that you will respect my opinions, even if they aren't backed by decades of LCA attendance, and I shall in return respect your opinions, and acknowledge your claim to a wealth of experience in running wikis, both for LCA and elsewhere. As long as we all come from a position of respect for the other's opinions, then vigorous debate is healthy.
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== Things to look for ==
 +
One thing to watch out for is people creating a duplicate page due to wrong spelling/case. eg front page has Partners Programme and Partners programme both listed.  
  
:The image above was created using [https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/FreeMind FreeMind], an open-source mindmapping tool. The current version of the *.mm data file is available for [https://mega.co.nz/#!2gBiGIyI!VZ0BR561IawW98eVdfd59VLhGMyQV7D0r7gfFxHM2KQ download] from my MEGA encrypted filesharing folder. Feel free to download it, tinker with it, rejig it, improve upon it, and repost a link to your improved version here. I'll continue working on it as well, alongside other wiki work. As we are now quite short on time before LCA2015 starts, I am going to continue doing what I've been doing, forging ahead with my n00bish plans to bring some semblance of order to the LCA wiki, until such time as someone contributes something here that pulls me up short, and I need to rethink my strategy to incorporate the suggestions. [[User:Augur_.|<font color="#703931">'''ᏜᏠᎶᏠᏑ'''</font>]][[User_talk:Augur_.|<font size="4" color="#723a32">&#x2710;</font>]][[Special:Contributions/Augur_.|<font size="4" color="#723a32">&#x2315;</font>]] 04:21, 11 December 2014 (AEDT)
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 +
Or the Attractions page is just a list of links. [[User:Lin Nah|Lin Nah]] ([[User talk:Lin Nah|talk]]) 16:32, 9 December 2014 (AEDT)
 +
:Yeah, got that. To help me fix such issues, it would be really handy if I had some superuser tools, such as the ability to move pages. Thanks. [[User:Augur_.|<font color="#703931">'''ᏜᏠᎶᏠᏑ'''</font>]][[User_talk:Augur_.|<font size="4" color="#723a32">&#x2710;</font>]][[Special:Contributions/Augur_.|<font size="4" color="#723a32">&#x2315;</font>]] 16:42, 9 December 2014 (AEDT)
 +
 
 +
== Explaining the lca2015 and other lca wikis ==
 +
 
 +
Looking at your mediawiki extension shopping/wish list, I think some stuff should have been explained sooner and I was going to do this way back when I was looking for someone to help with the wiki.
 +
 
 +
* User accounts
 +
** Users can't create an account to edit in the linux.conf.au wiki.
 +
** The only users who can edit the wiki are users who have signed up on the lca2015 website and that account is used for signing up in this wiki. That is why you couldn't create an account in this wiki when you first tried a few weeks ago, shortly after my email asking for help on wiki.
 +
** All users who edit the wiki have agreed to the lca2015 code of conduct and the terms & conditions.
 +
** This means your extensions for vandals, and the next list below it isn't needed.
 +
 
 +
* Use of wiki
 +
** The wiki will start to be used more and more the closer we get to the conference. I haven't kept track of how the previous wikis have grown or looked at how often they are used.
 +
** After the conference there may be an edit or two to add links to stuff. For example if someone offered to find out about x, they may put the link to the info there etc.
 +
** Presenters may also edit it to add links to where the slides are for talks or where the talk videos are.
 +
** Attendees sometimes add links to their photos.
 +
** The amount of edits and even views on the wiki drops off after conference week.
 +
 
 +
* If you need to link to lca2015 website, please always use the url with lca2015.linux.org.au. This means when the wiki is archived, along with website, links to the lca2015 website should still work.
 +
 
 +
Sorry will have to go now. will add more later
 +
 
 +
 
 +
[[User:Lin Nah|Lin Nah]] ([[User talk:Lin Nah|talk]]) 19:06, 9 December 2014 (AEDT)
 +
 
 +
:Wow, a wiki without the threat of vandals! That will certainly make my life simpler. Thanks for explaining that Lin. Much of my former experience with wiki work has been in defeating spam, carefully patrolling user edits, and defeating spam, with a little bit of templating and categorizing thrown in for good measure, and defeating more spam. I'm looking forward to this spam-free environment. [[User:Augur_.|<font color="#703931">'''ᏜᏠᎶᏠᏑ'''</font>]][[User_talk:Augur_.|<font size="4" color="#723a32">&#x2710;</font>]][[Special:Contributions/Augur_.|<font size="4" color="#723a32">&#x2315;</font>]] 19:20, 9 December 2014 (AEDT)
 +
 
 +
* Media like Video on lca wikis
 +
** No videos or sound files are uploaded to the wiki
 +
** There will be links to videos + sound files so people know where they are. These are videos of talks or other videos.
 +
** Videos are uploaded somewhere like youtube (or vimeo).
 +
** The links to those videos are wiki'd so people know where they are. Also aren't always able to put the links on the conference website because the people who are able to update the lca conference site are usually too busy during the conference.
 +
** Also won't be unusal if there's a server on campus with the video files so people who wish to down the vids before they head home may do so.
 +
** There is also a final repository for all the vids.
 +
** I don't think it is wise to have people run videos off the wiki. using youtube for videos means they use another network's infrastructure to cope with space + network.
 +
 
 +
* Uses of wiki at linux.conf.au
 +
** Wiki to help organise events, both official + unofficial.
 +
*** If a miniconf or tutorial needs a webpage, they are advised to use the wiki. If they don't wish to use the wiki, there'll be a link from the wiki to the actual miniconf/tutorial webpage. See the current miniconfs page as example. The Open Radio and Astronomy miniconfs are using the wiki for their page. The Sysadmin miniconf and open hardware miniconf have their own page.
 +
*** BOFs - Birds of a feather sessions are organised via wiki. This could be BOFs that happen at the scheduled time + place for BOFs or at other times. There's also activity like Yoga, martial arts, running that have BOFs.
 +
*** organising social events with other lca attendees. eg lca2014 had an outing to an Indian Ocean swim. There was a whiskey BOF that may or may not have been wiki'd at lca2011 (can't remember). Looks like there's a plan Auckland - Wellington rail trip.
 +
*** unPDNS - This is for people who are not going to the Penguin dinner. There's other evenings too and people organise something for that.
 +
*** As you see, the Partner's programme has a page in the wiki.
 +
 
 +
** Wiki as repository of information useful to conference attendees
 +
*** This is already happening but may need some help with. I am not sure if anyone is coordinating the stuff. Thing like what mobile networks we have, what sort of plugs + votage for electricity, where to go for emergency info.
 +
*** where to eat, drink, play while they are at the conference.  Much of this is by conference attendees.
 +
*** what logos of badge mean
 +
*** Swag - usually one of the attendees lists out the swag they receive + others add to it. some even take a pic + link to pic. This is mostly done by attendees.
 +
 
 +
 
 +
** Wiki as source of link to info useful to conference attendees.
 +
*** links to video, slides, github repos for talks or even for stuff someone is talking about at a BOF or think someon at the conference may find useful.
 +
*** Attendees sometimes add a link to where their lca photo album is.
 +
 
 +
 
 +
[[User:Lin Nah|Lin Nah]] ([[User talk:Lin Nah|talk]]) 22:28, 10 December 2014 (AEDT)
 +
 
 +
:Thanks Lin, that's all useful information and I'll bear it in mind as I work on the wiki. I'm wanting to help coordinate / curate the repository of information that is on the wiki, including gathering links to resources such as bus timetables, mobile network info, local eateries around the venue, etc. That is a big part of the attraction for me in helping out with the LCA wiki. It is an opportunity for me to put my Aspie tendencies to good use! [[User:Augur_.|<font color="#703931">'''ᏜᏠᎶᏠᏑ'''</font>]][[User_talk:Augur_.|<font size="4" color="#723a32">&#x2710;</font>]][[Special:Contributions/Augur_.|<font size="4" color="#723a32">&#x2315;</font>]] 04:31, 11 December 2014 (AEDT)

Revision as of 04:31, 11 December 2014

So much stuff isn't working here yet

I'm starting to think that much of the normal stuff I regularly do in other wikis is reliant on installed extensions. So much of what I've been trying here already, such as adding my box template, or altering the {{DISPLAYTITLE}} for my home page, doesn't seem to be working. I've already put in a request (via Lin Nah) for a list of common MediaWiki extensions to be installed here, to support some of the features I use regularly. Will have to wait and see if/when some of them get installed, whether the tricks I've been trying to use will suddenly start working. ᏜᏠᎶᏠᏑ 18:06, 8 December 2014 (AEDT)

It is not just the extensions, but some of the back-end configuration is also not set up the way I'd normally expect a wiki to be set up. For instance, the $wgNamespacesWithSubpages option has not been enabled for the Template: namespace, meaning that the normal way of documenting templates using the {{/doc}} command is unavailable. InterWiki doesn't seem to have been enabled either. Also, my Preferences don't seem to have saved between sessions, so I've lost my custom signature between logins, along with my regional settings, etc. I'd really appreciate having access to the back-end of the wiki, to set some of this stuff up properly, if that's okay? Augur . (talk) 19:19, 8 December 2014 (AEDT)
just sent you an email. Suggest you check out previous LCA wikis to see how it is being used by the conference attendees. Lin Nah (talk) 19:45, 8 December 2014 (AEDT)
Thanks Lin, got that. Looks like the file uploads are working now. I'd still like to get some of those MW extensions installed from the list I gave you earlier. ᏜᏠᎶᏠᏑ 13:33, 9 December 2014 (AEDT)
I'm stalled again. Much of what I want to accomplish at the moment relies heavily on ParserFunctions, such as the ever-handy {{#if:}} conditional statement. Any chance that could be the first MW extension from my wishlist to be installed, please? ᏜᏠᎶᏠᏑ 14:43, 9 December 2014 (AEDT)
I didn't ask for the parser function to be installed because I wanted to see what else you want installed (see below) and check them out. Also didn't think my upload problem would be resolved so quickly.Lin Nah (talk) 16:32, 9 December 2014 (AEDT)

Media Wiki extensions

Can you list the extensions you want installed or is the ParserFunctions the only extension? It just saves time if we have a list. Before they are installed, someone needs to ensure the stuff on the list will not result in unintended consequences if used is allowed. Lin Nah (talk) 16:32, 9 December 2014 (AEDT)

I thought you might ask. I've just created such a list here. ᏜᏠᎶᏠᏑ 16:39, 9 December 2014 (AEDT)

Things to look for

One thing to watch out for is people creating a duplicate page due to wrong spelling/case. eg front page has Partners Programme and Partners programme both listed.


Or the Attractions page is just a list of links. Lin Nah (talk) 16:32, 9 December 2014 (AEDT)

Yeah, got that. To help me fix such issues, it would be really handy if I had some superuser tools, such as the ability to move pages. Thanks. ᏜᏠᎶᏠᏑ 16:42, 9 December 2014 (AEDT)

Explaining the lca2015 and other lca wikis

Looking at your mediawiki extension shopping/wish list, I think some stuff should have been explained sooner and I was going to do this way back when I was looking for someone to help with the wiki.

  • User accounts
    • Users can't create an account to edit in the linux.conf.au wiki.
    • The only users who can edit the wiki are users who have signed up on the lca2015 website and that account is used for signing up in this wiki. That is why you couldn't create an account in this wiki when you first tried a few weeks ago, shortly after my email asking for help on wiki.
    • All users who edit the wiki have agreed to the lca2015 code of conduct and the terms & conditions.
    • This means your extensions for vandals, and the next list below it isn't needed.
  • Use of wiki
    • The wiki will start to be used more and more the closer we get to the conference. I haven't kept track of how the previous wikis have grown or looked at how often they are used.
    • After the conference there may be an edit or two to add links to stuff. For example if someone offered to find out about x, they may put the link to the info there etc.
    • Presenters may also edit it to add links to where the slides are for talks or where the talk videos are.
    • Attendees sometimes add links to their photos.
    • The amount of edits and even views on the wiki drops off after conference week.
  • If you need to link to lca2015 website, please always use the url with lca2015.linux.org.au. This means when the wiki is archived, along with website, links to the lca2015 website should still work.

Sorry will have to go now. will add more later


Lin Nah (talk) 19:06, 9 December 2014 (AEDT)

Wow, a wiki without the threat of vandals! That will certainly make my life simpler. Thanks for explaining that Lin. Much of my former experience with wiki work has been in defeating spam, carefully patrolling user edits, and defeating spam, with a little bit of templating and categorizing thrown in for good measure, and defeating more spam. I'm looking forward to this spam-free environment. ᏜᏠᎶᏠᏑ 19:20, 9 December 2014 (AEDT)
  • Media like Video on lca wikis
    • No videos or sound files are uploaded to the wiki
    • There will be links to videos + sound files so people know where they are. These are videos of talks or other videos.
    • Videos are uploaded somewhere like youtube (or vimeo).
    • The links to those videos are wiki'd so people know where they are. Also aren't always able to put the links on the conference website because the people who are able to update the lca conference site are usually too busy during the conference.
    • Also won't be unusal if there's a server on campus with the video files so people who wish to down the vids before they head home may do so.
    • There is also a final repository for all the vids.
    • I don't think it is wise to have people run videos off the wiki. using youtube for videos means they use another network's infrastructure to cope with space + network.
  • Uses of wiki at linux.conf.au
    • Wiki to help organise events, both official + unofficial.
      • If a miniconf or tutorial needs a webpage, they are advised to use the wiki. If they don't wish to use the wiki, there'll be a link from the wiki to the actual miniconf/tutorial webpage. See the current miniconfs page as example. The Open Radio and Astronomy miniconfs are using the wiki for their page. The Sysadmin miniconf and open hardware miniconf have their own page.
      • BOFs - Birds of a feather sessions are organised via wiki. This could be BOFs that happen at the scheduled time + place for BOFs or at other times. There's also activity like Yoga, martial arts, running that have BOFs.
      • organising social events with other lca attendees. eg lca2014 had an outing to an Indian Ocean swim. There was a whiskey BOF that may or may not have been wiki'd at lca2011 (can't remember). Looks like there's a plan Auckland - Wellington rail trip.
      • unPDNS - This is for people who are not going to the Penguin dinner. There's other evenings too and people organise something for that.
      • As you see, the Partner's programme has a page in the wiki.
    • Wiki as repository of information useful to conference attendees
      • This is already happening but may need some help with. I am not sure if anyone is coordinating the stuff. Thing like what mobile networks we have, what sort of plugs + votage for electricity, where to go for emergency info.
      • where to eat, drink, play while they are at the conference. Much of this is by conference attendees.
      • what logos of badge mean
      • Swag - usually one of the attendees lists out the swag they receive + others add to it. some even take a pic + link to pic. This is mostly done by attendees.


    • Wiki as source of link to info useful to conference attendees.
      • links to video, slides, github repos for talks or even for stuff someone is talking about at a BOF or think someon at the conference may find useful.
      • Attendees sometimes add a link to where their lca photo album is.


Lin Nah (talk) 22:28, 10 December 2014 (AEDT)

Thanks Lin, that's all useful information and I'll bear it in mind as I work on the wiki. I'm wanting to help coordinate / curate the repository of information that is on the wiki, including gathering links to resources such as bus timetables, mobile network info, local eateries around the venue, etc. That is a big part of the attraction for me in helping out with the LCA wiki. It is an opportunity for me to put my Aspie tendencies to good use! ᏜᏠᎶᏠᏑ 04:31, 11 December 2014 (AEDT)